Bonus Episode Introduction

SPEAKER_02 0:03

The stories, theories, and perspectives discussed in this episode reflect the opinions and interpretations of the hosts and guests and are intended for informational and entertainment purposes only. While we strive for accuracy and evidence-based discussion, not all claims presented are universally accepted as fact. We encourage listeners to think critically, explore the evidence, and come to their own conclusions. With that said, enjoy. Welcome to the special bonus episode of Inquarium. We were recently invited to join Anthony Diaz on his show 50 States of Terror for a conversation all about the commonly reported behaviors of Bigfoot, from vocalizations to wood knocks to tree structures, rock throwing, and interactions with people. Anthony was kind enough to let us share that conversation here with all of you, so please enjoy this special bonus episode.

Meet Anthony Diaz of 50 States of Terror

SPEAKER_01 1:27

Okay. Hello, everybody. My name is Anthony Diaz. I'm the host of Fifty States of Terror, the American Cryptid Podcast. And with me is my my two really good friends, Michael and Stephen. Boys, introduce yourselves, please.

SPEAKER_00 1:43

I'm Stephen Dudley. I'm my he's Stephen Dudley. I'm Michael Walker. We co-host the Inquarium Podcasts uh coming to you soon, September 8th.

SPEAKER_01 1:56

That's awesome. That is awesome. Yeah, this is take two. This is our second take at this because we just discovered that Riverside, this is your fault. All your fault. Unless you want to give one of us, both of us, all of us, a sponsorship deal, then it's not your fault. It's the internet's fault. So I'll blame that.

SPEAKER_00 2:16

Yeah. But it gives an excuse to talk about Bigfoot again. So here we are.

SPEAKER_01 2:22

Yeah, it's a great segue. We are talking about Bigfoot once again. Um, so yeah. Uh for everybody who listens to Fifty States of Terror, I appreciate every single one of you who listens to the show. Um, you all know that I have said in the past that I will do a Bigfoot episode, uh, but it's I'm gonna have it like in a couple segments. Um I'm doing full research on it because it's a heavy hitter, it's one of the top fives, right close to Mothman and Jersey Devil, all of the heavy hitters of the cryptids. This is not going to be that episode. Um, and also because no one gets to claim Bigfoot, no state gets to claim Bigfoot. That's one of the rules I established from the very beginning. No one, no state gets to claim Bigfoot. But today we are going to chat about Bigfoot behaviors, and we're gonna get into some really interesting concepts. Um, because last time we we did this recording, uh, we talked about tracking, we talked about um ancestral behaviors, we talked about uh the possibility of it being uh rooted into uh from indigenous peoples folklore, from giants, and from all of those great things that culminate into what we believe or think or hypothesize about uh the main man Sasquatch. So let's get started. Let's get started. I want to start with Steven uh because the the the tracking class that you took that was uh fascinating. Uh please uh go start let's start let's start there.

Bigfoot Tracking, Stealth & Wilderness Awareness

SPEAKER_00 4:07

Well, let me let me start by saying to the reason why we started talking about tracking because we all we all agree that Bigfoot, Sasquatch, Yeti has an incredible ability to track and to stay hidden. And we were and we were making that correlation with Native Americans and other indigenous people who seem to have the same ability. And then coincidentally, Steven has firsthand account uh going to this tracker school, so take it away, Stephen.

SPEAKER_02 4:39

Yeah, uh it's mostly about the ability of Bigfoot to to remain hidden, and I think that a lot of people tend to categorize Bigfoot as being more like gorillas and and more predictable and I have a loose theory that that's not the case, and that they're if they are as in intelligent as we are or or close to it, maybe uh more intelligent in their environment than we are, then if they would have the ability, as did the ancient Lip and Apache scouts, had to remain hidden from their enemies. You could be in the immediate area just practically standing on top of a Lip and Apache scout and you would not know they're there. So if you have a creature like Bigfoot that's in their own environment and they are super intelligent and they lived out there all the time, their awareness and their abilities would become incredible. Like bordering supernatural, and and there were there were a couple of uh native uh Liban Apache twin brothers who were both scouts, they're both scouts and shaman of their of their tribe. And this goes back to antiquity, this is like many, many generations back. But my my teacher told me that he considered these people, the these these twins as gods of the wilderness. And that's what I consider if if Bigfoot as a species exists, because I don't believe it exists as an individual, but as a species I do believe it can exist because of if it does have this intelligence. So I think people tend to underestimate that ability. I think they they tend to underestimate the abilities of people a lot of times. The tracker that taught me, his name was Tom Brown Jr. Uh I went to his school. Uh he his case studies were amazing because a lot of times on some of his uh tracking missions, he would ignore the sign tracking and go with his gut feeling, and he got results from that. So there there's actually one time where he all the sign told him to go left and his gut told him to go right. So he did that, and he saw a glint, wound up finding this child's backpack, later kick picked up the tr the trail again and continued until he found the child. So I just think that people should not jump to conclusions and assume that they understand what this creature is. I think it's on a whole new level. So that's my take on as far as them being able to remain hidden.

When Did We Start Believing in Bigfoot?

SPEAKER_01 7:42

No, we we all believe in in in Sasquatch um Bigfoot. Uh when did when did both of you start uh believing? And if you didn't believe, when did you start believing again?

SPEAKER_00 7:57

Uh well for me my introduction to uh Bigfoot was actually the uh Patterson Gimlin film. You know, uh I remember as a uh a child or young young adult, maybe seeing it on TV, some documentary or something. Uh that was my first exposure to it. Um a lot of times growing up, we didn't even have a TV. So um happened to catch a documentary on it. I thought that wow, that's really fascinating, it's really interesting. Um, but I didn't really have an opinion at the time. Uh it seemed real to me. Um, and then my journey over the decades is kind of wavered back and forth, you know, both sides presenting uh good evidence, or or or the side that doesn't uh believe presenting uh reasonable discrediting evidence. Um but where I am today is a hundred percent, a hundred percent uh believe because there's just too much credible evidence out there from credible people uh spanning hundreds of years. You know, the Native Americans, this is something that's been in their you mentioned it, Anthony, this is something that's been in their heritage for hundreds, thousands of years, you know, and I think you know, there was a common belief, I think, early on in academia, that you know, a lot of this stuff is just folklore. This is, you know, these people are you know, they don't understand how science works, they don't understand how the world works, so they just make up these stories to make sense to themselves, and maybe coming off as maybe not being as intelligent as the modern man. But as it turns out, they're way more intelligent as far as being connected to nature than we ever were. I mean, they knew more and more about the stars than we do. We never look at the stars unless there's you know a comet that's coming, and everyone on Facebook knows there's a and everyone goes look in the sky. Most of us don't ever look to the sky, and they that's all they had, that's all they did all day long, every every day. They just looked at the sky and they study the surroundings, they studied their nature because that was what was that was their tablet, that was their internet. So um, so I believe those stories. I believe the stories of Native Americans and other indigenous people all around the world, not just in America or North America, it's all over the world.

SPEAKER_02 10:20

I agree. Uh I think there's plenty of evidence. Uh the the turning point for me uh as a kid, I was I guess I was about ten years old, and uh my I got a a book for Christmas on Bigfoot, Bigfoot stories. And for the long for the longest time in my li my short life, I always thought that Bigfoot was an individual, and I read this book and I quickly realized that it was a species. And uh it was also I also realized from the book that we were dealing some of the stories were t very bizarre. Like straight up like sidings with UFOs at the same time of a siding with supposed Bigfoot. So it it quickly got real spooky really fast, but once I realized I was like, oh, they're talking about a species here, then that kind of I I wouldn't say I I fully believed it at that point, but I was certainly f far more open to it. And then as I my later adult years I realized what what people can do and if something is as intelligent as this thing is, then there's no reason for me to believe that they they're not smart enough to get the calories they need from the wilderness to survive. Because we can do it. Like scouts today, people from the survival school can do that. Right. The idea is that you need to be able to walk out into a desert and thrive. Not just survive, you thrive. So yeah. So it was about 10 years old when it really started kind of changing for me.

Cryptid Research & Theories About Sasquatch

SPEAKER_01 11:58

Yeah, there is a there is definitely a point to where I just thought it was just like there's there's no way. There's absolutely just no way that something like this could could ex could survive and exist out there. And at a very young age, it was like it was coinciding with uh with things like um the early belief in the supernatural. And once like once credible information started coming in from like people who I trusted about who's who's experiencing uh supernatural or experiencing ghosts or things of paranormal and things like that, and then it opened up this thing of of research, researching the the um credible uh researches that go into cryptozoology, like Lauren Coleman and Grover Kronz. And I believe and I am I am one of those who subscribe to their to their methodology uh methodologies in research into crypto into cryptids, especially Sasquatch, where Coleman believes that there is enough credible, unexplained reports to exist to justify Sasquatch as a cryptid for questioning. And then Kranz uh believes that this is a a uh biological primate. And again, uh Michael, I'm going to have to have you uh say that I get the Picthecus. That one he proposed it it's a relationship to that, and it's an a biological um uh framework, and there are many, many different theories as to why like we haven't seen one face to face, why it hasn't come come forward, why why does it uh seem to just disappear in into Steven's uh and Stephen's point is ability to like manipulate its surroundings to just vanish. Um there's there's things that I that I myself believe is is that there are roughly 5,000 miles of untracked tunnels in our uh underground uh systems in the in the United States. So I truly believe that there are things that we have yet to even discover because humans cannot get that far down or haven't uh had a need to go that far down as of as of yet. So it's plausible that there are ways that these creatures like enter our realm, so to speak, uh, from those from those systems. Now, we also touched a little bit on the uh ancestral nature of Sasquatch and the prop the probability of it being cousins of different creatures, such as the Yeti, the Yeren, the uh Oran Pandeck from Sumatra and the Almas from uh Central Asia. Uh, what are your thoughts about the relationship between our Sasquatch and others from different countries?

Bigfoot Relatives, Subspecies & Gigantopithecus

SPEAKER_02 14:55

Well, I think it would be linked uh if they're all related, which they they must be. I say that loosely, but when the sea levels, I think, Michael, you were talking about that last time when the sea levels were lower. Yeah, I think it's feasible that they could be related.

SPEAKER_00 15:10

Yeah, I mean, there's no reason to suggest they they don't. I mean, we have all different kinds of dog breeds, cat breeds, different types of deer, different types of bear. Uh, there's no reason to to think rationally why there wouldn't be different subspecies or you know, classifications of Bigfoot. I mean, you have the skunk ape ape that lives you know in the Everglades. Well, it's it's adapted to living in that environment. It's not cold, you know, it's not in the frozen tundra, it's not deep forest. There are forest areas, but it's you know, it's gonna be it's gonna behave and have different characteristics than than a Bigfoot that's more in Northern America or up in the frozen tundra. Right, you know, uh, so there's no reason that you know the one area that they probably wouldn't be in is the desert because there's no coverage, no tree, and plus they're a large creature, so they need they need a lot of fuel to feed themselves. So you go where the food is, and that's in the deep forests. And as you kind of alluded to, that there's no reason to think we do have fossil records of the gigantipithecus. So and it it was very much if you look at and you study that creature from uh prehistoric times, it it very much looks like a modern-day Bigfoot. Yeah, very similar, large-sized, large bipedal, uh, ape-like creature. And so there's no reason to suggest uh to think that that those the Bigfoot that we see today isn't uh an ancestor of that creature. So it's it's totally plausible. And I and I mentioned this uh last time, but you know, we're always finding, even in modern times, we're finding new species of quote unquote normal animals that we thought were extinct or didn't even know exist. So I'd mentioned before about this shark. It was found in 2025. So just last year, they thought this thing was extinct for millions of years, and they found it near Easter Island, and they found a whole family of it, a whole school of these sharks that they thought were long extinct. So it's not far-fetched to think that there's a a creature who lives out in the it might as be the deep ocean, right? When you talk about these forests, and you mentioned this before, Stephen. These forests are vast. I mean, if you just take a square mile of forest and somebody goes in there and hides, you may never find them.

SPEAKER_02 17:36

So if you have children get lost all the time. Yeah, and it happens really fast. And and yeah, that's a whole nother podcast.

SPEAKER_00 17:46

And North America and in North America are our the forest systems are so vast, they cover states across many, many states. Thousands of square thousands, tens of thousands of square miles of forest.

Survival, Migration & Finding Food

SPEAKER_02 18:00

Yeah, it's it's easy to sit in in your in front of your computer and and uh and and think you can imagine how how vast it is, but it it really is immense. So it something you know c a large creature like that could hide, especially being intelligent. So and like I said, you know, they're gonna know how to pull calories out of that environment to survive. And it's not gonna be it's not gonna be like what it's probably not gonna be what you think. You know, like we had mentioned before, uh they were talking about uh migrating from the Pacific Northwest potentially down to like Oklahoma, I believe. Like curving around like heading from the Pacific Northwest, heading east, I believe, and then south. They they have a route. Well they were finding d deer with broken front legs and their livers cut out in the wintertime. Yeah. So it's kinda like the grizzlies, you know. The fatter they get, the less of the fish they eat. They go straight for the guts. They go m for more for the stuff that's high calorie content. So these creatures know this. I mean, they've been here for how long? And if again, I don't think they're like gorillas, I think they're like smart like us. They're gonna it's feasible that they could figure out how to do that and just pass that those teachings on.

SPEAKER_00 19:23

Yeah, and the liver thing is common with that with many different uh animals in nature, especially like the the killer whales. They are very well known to attack sharks and extract just the liver. They hit them head on, you know, hit them head on from the side with with surgical precision, they know exactly where that liver is and they extract it, and then they leave the rest of the carcass. Because, like you said, it's high content of survivability, it's high uh because it takes calories to hunt, and you know, then that's so if you just pinpoint, get the maximum amount of nutrition from one organ, you could, you know, the net effect is a positive effect, yeah, as far as calories go.

SPEAKER_01 20:10

Yeah, especially when you're talking about uh behaviors uh uh of Sasquatch, like this this is just another tick in the in like in the numerous amount of of things that that it can do to survive from from its uh evolutionary traits. And like just doing like just just thinking about how high something like uh Denali is or is or the Appalachian Mountains, like it's incredibly high, incredibly high in its peaks. So when you have a no population going up there and living up there, and you have a species that can survive and knows how to survive in those areas, like it's it's it just goes into that that whole full plausibility that it's it's just uh evolutionary knows how to stay alive and teaching their young to do this to do the same exact thing. Now, regardless of of what I believe in in the um in the underground systems, but that does offer a way to to uh justify some of these uh videos that we've been seeing from like TikTok and Instagram, some of which have been taken down about uh people filming and then spotting a large bipedal creature on on these uh hillsides, and then they just probably just pan away and pan back and it's and it's and it's gone. So when we talk about behaviors and talk about things like that, one of the things that come that come to everybody's uh uh off offense onto why it can't be like true is why haven't more people taped it or why haven't more people like filmed it and with everybody having some type of access. To a camera now. What do you all think about that?

Why Don’t We See More Bigfoot Footage?

SPEAKER_00 22:04

Well, let's keep in mind that they're not motivated to find us. You know, that's a human thing. We're trying to discover them. They know about us. That's true. They have no reason. They have no reason. I mean, sure, there's some cases where it seems like they do seem to watch, they like to enjoy watching us from a distance, but they're not trying to come out and find us unless we encroach on their territory or capture one of their young or you know uh do something to disrupt their livelihood. There's no motivation for them to come interact with us. So they have every motivation to stay away from us, uh, especially if they're they're seeing hunters out there and they're seeing what humans are doing to other species. You know, they have no motivation to to come to us.

SPEAKER_01 22:50

So uh I wouldn't I wouldn't want to find us either. So like that's yeah, exactly.

Why Haven’t We Found Bigfoot Bones?

SPEAKER_00 22:56

Uh and you and you kind of alluded to this a little bit. We talked about this last time when we recorded was another thing is people say, Well, how can we find found carcasses or bones? We don't find bare bones, deer. I mean, you might find some antlers here and there, or you know, but in the wild west, you'd find the horns of a cow, but you wouldn't find the skeleton of a cow, or maybe the skull.

SPEAKER_02 23:18

Well, yeah, they but yeah, and and they say like in areas of the Pacific Northwest, I think it was a scientist with the Bigfoot Research Foundation or organization talking about how bones even break down just in a couple of years in those environments. So so these things now if you're in a desert, you'll you'll have a bone sitting there, it's probably been there for 200 years. You know, right. The desert's a different environment. But in these really wet and wilderness areas, it's like there there have been people who have been tracked and there's nothing left of them because animals consume them. So that's a morbid morbid idea, but it's still it's it's a reason why sometimes maybe you don't find stuff.

SPEAKER_00 23:57

Well, and and bones contain a lot of nutrition, calcium and other things, the bone marrow. So uh yeah, in those deep forests, there's a lot of competition for food. So yeah, when something drops in the middle of the forest, there's gonna be lots of competition and to devour every every nutritional thing you can from that creature, whether it's hum human or a sasquatch or whatever.

SPEAKER_02 24:21

Yeah, and it only takes a couple like a year or two for it to get covered up with foliage, leaves, and then it it may not be gone, but it's covered up. Sure. So it's it's not it's not as simple as people think. You know, that it's you can't just walk out there and I mean they they used to with tracking, they they consider if you find a skull that it's a sacred thing because it marks the end of the story. So as you're track as you're tracking a creature, you're reading its story footprint by footprint. And then when you get to the end, that's that's the end. So and those are rare. We're just animals, period. So you can imagine something that's this intelligent that knows, oh well, we need the we need to cover this up or we need to conceal it or or whatnot, you know, you're you're not gonna find it. It's not gonna be it's not even gonna be like an animal.

SPEAKER_01 25:10

So And this also this also goes in goes into our discussion about it being a highly intelligent intelligent creature already, because if that's the if that's the case, then we can assume or likely assume that it would bury their dead, that it would have some type of uh I know you I don't want to call it ritualistic, but symbolic gestures for the dead. So there's a possibility that it could be buried, and that's the reason why we haven't found uh anything else.

SPEAKER_00 25:42

Also, if they know they're close to the end of life, they may go somewhere really deep in the forest, or you know. Well, for instance, buffalo, I don't know if you know about this, but I learned this that when we took a tour of the state park in North Dakota or South Dakota. The buffalo, when the male gets a certain age and it it doesn't, it's not procreating anymore, it goes off on its own. And it it spends the rest of its life away from the herd all by itself, and it goes off to die in a lonely existence for you know how many more years it's got left.

SPEAKER_03 26:13

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 26:14

So you can imagine why wouldn't a Bigfoot do something like that if it knows it can't contribute to the tribe or contribute to the family unit, it's gonna just go off and go somewhere and die and maybe well.

SPEAKER_02 26:27

I can see some of their language being it sounds like people gibbering sometimes. So if they have a language like that, then it's it seems reasonable that they would have some rituals.

Bigfoot Vocalizations & the Sierra Sounds

SPEAKER_00 26:37

And that's another behavior we talked about was vocalizations and calls. Yes, yes, stuff, which is common. And uh one of the things that is one of the fit more famous cases it happened in the uh Sierra Nevadas, where uh you had an outdoorsman named Ron Moorhead and this uh journalist, Alan Barry, and they recorded these recordings are very famous. They spent a few days out there recording what they thought were conversations between at least two, if not more, Bigfoot or Sasquatch. Well, later a group of scientists, Lynn Curlin and Leslie Hertel, used software to try to analyze this and try to see if they could debunk it, you know, and and see if there was any in interesting patterns or information. To identify it.

unknown 27:22

Right.

SPEAKER_00 27:22

Yeah. So what they discovered was that these sounds could not have been made from a human because of the way the vocal works were not large enough to make those types of vocalizations. So I thought that was pretty interesting. It really led credibility to their recordings, and they also proved that they there wasn't manipulated, the tape wasn't slowed down or sped up to try to change the pitch of the sounds. And then some uh another researcher, Scott Nelson, analyzed it that chatter that you were talking about, Stephen, and noticed recurring patterns of structured sentences and language.

SPEAKER_03 28:02

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 28:02

And then another researcher, Nancy Logan, also came across and said the same thing. They saw patterns of language. Now, this is another way to demonstrate how intelligent these creatures are. I mean, lots of animals have ways of communicating, but we don't we don't call it language. These are an actual language, a pattern of sounds. And like you said, gibberish, it almost sounds like you know, a drunk Scottish, you know, trying to speak English. It sounds really weird. I remember hearing it sounded very bizarre. Yeah, so uh I thought that was very interesting too, because that also suggests a level of intelligence even higher than maybe an ape uh or a primate.

SPEAKER_01 28:38

Yeah, because um I believe I was watching a a YouTube about vocalization, and they were trying to pitch it next to a fox yip or like a cougar or like some other type of animal, and it it wouldn't, it just it wouldn't it wouldn't be the same pitch, it wouldn't be the same frequency or nothing. So it was definitely something something something else. And um I I do remember I do remember there were the one of the researchers was was saying that if if this if this was an animal like a fox or like a coyote, there would there would be similarities, there would be like strict points of pitches because that's how that's how they would communicate whether or not there was there is a threat coming in. It's it's it has to be exact, it has to be something that everybody else can uh in their pack can identify and uh distinguish. But these recordings were were different pitches and different and uh different frequencies and things like that. And one of the things that I absolutely love about something like Sasquatch is the amount of research that comes with it. Because for the show, I do I pick an obscure cryptid for like a state and I do a research, like a small little research show on it. So like the cactus cat, the hodag, um, the squonk, the snally gaster, you know, and most of the research comes in the form of newspaper clippings or maybe once one or two pictures or drawings of first hand accounts. Something like Bigfoot has so much research behind it, it is a fascinating thing to get into because then then you start to branch off of like, well, uh can this thing, can this being, can this creature uh really be out there? And the answer for myself and for many people is yeah, man. Like you it's uh it's one of those things to where uh if you were to to ask uh a skeptic like why don't you believe, and it's like, well, prove me wrong. Well, I'm uh there's there's a give and take here. Like I have I have all of this stuff ready to present to you, but it's it's falling on on deaf ears. But when you or someone like you gets asked okay, why do you believe that? Like w w like and a skeptic asks you, well, you can't really believe in this stuff, right? Like what what's your what's your gut your gut reaction, your gut response?

Skepticism, Evidence & Why We Believe

SPEAKER_02 31:19

My gut response is that we we've survived in those environments. So if we if we can do it and and uh uh some other species is as intelligent as we are or close to it, and they're by far masters of their environment compared to us, why wouldn't they be able to exist? Being that smart, they would be able to pull calories, like I said before, out of the environment. They're masters of their environment. They're gods of the wilderness. So that would be that would be my it's not proof. And I and I believe being skeptical is very healthy. Yeah, I think that leads us to the truth. We don't just believe it's just like a lot of the videos I'm seeing nowadays, I just I'm stamping them as AI created, you know. Yeah. But that's just because I'm a skeptic with that. I'm not buying every video that I see. Some of the older ones are more interesting. It's it's not proof, but as far as their ability, you know, their intelligence is is what gives them the ability to pull calories out of the environment and and their ability to survive, especially as a group. So there's no reason why that's not reasonable. So that is very reasonable to me.

SPEAKER_00 32:26

Yeah, for me it it's it's probably a three-prong thing. One, we have archaeological uh evidence that gigantipithecus we know existed. We have bones, we have skulls. So there's no reason why to think that this these aren't ancestors of uh a known creature, you know, uh that happens in nature all the time. Uh the other part is there's just so many credible people. I mean, it'd be like saying that I know there's a lot of people who think that uh the earth is flat, but that would be like trying to get everybody on the planet, all the scientists in the world to say that the the conspiracy that the earth is round. You know, it's just too there's just too much credible evidence from credible people. Um and and to touch on what Steven said is if you if you want the some of the best evidence, go watch some of these uh documentaries from the 1960s and 70s, way before you know computer animation, before AI, before a lot of special effects, and uh you listen to these stories and you and you see this evidence, uh that's a good place to start. Because and it may not be logically you would think that would be the great place to start, but it really is because there's not a lot of tomfoolery going on there. You know, these are earnest, honest people who are just they don't even a lot of these people don't even want to share their stories. Right. They shy away from it. I was just about to say that.

SPEAKER_01 33:59

I was just about to say there's there's no glory into coming forward with with a uh a Sasquatch story or or any cryptid for that matter. There's no there's no like like pot of gold at the end of the rainbow when you're when you're talking about and relatively trying to prove these these things existence. So someone who comes forward, like the the likelihood of it actually happening is substantial because there's you don't get anything from it.

SPEAKER_00 34:28

And honestly, that's that's the first sign that it's probably not real, is when people too try to monetize it. Like we talked last time about this uh researcher or Bigfoot person who's claims they have all these body parts he's from. Oh right, yes, and they and they passed away and passed it on to their son.

SPEAKER_01 34:48

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 34:49

And it's like, okay, great. Let's analyze them. This is fantastic. This is the best news ever. We everyone wants the body. You got several of them. Let the scientific community examine them. Let you know.

SPEAKER_02 35:02

Uh the uh I think that's the one you're talking about. Uh they have a an adolescent as well. Uh yep. The adolescent looks like a Muppet to me. Yeah. It looks like a Muppet. So, you know. Uh but yeah, like if you're trying to monetized, yeah. Let's analyze it, like you say.

SPEAKER_00 35:20

Yeah. And if you're trying to monetize, then that to me is a red flag. That yeah. Uh because you're not doing it for the right reasons.

Hoaxes, the Minnesota Iceman & Questionable Evidence

SPEAKER_01 35:27

Uh and I I couldn't remember what it was, but now I remember. It's the Minnesota, the Minnesota Iceman. And the Minnesota Iceman, if you don't know, is from the 60s and 70s, and this dude had a claim that he had a a man on ice that was a Neanderthal and was going in state fairs and carnivals and charging money to to view this this thing. Um later it was it was 100% debunked as a hoax. And um, but this this falls in line with so many other cryptid stories. And for the for the life of me, I can't remember a whole lot of them. Uh, but there's there is one of a taxidermy dog, and the dog is supposed to be a crypto. I can't remember where the dog cryptid is.

SPEAKER_00 36:17

Um is it the one that's the hat half dog, half elegator? Is that is that the one you're calling it?

SPEAKER_01 36:22

No, no, hold on.

SPEAKER_00 36:23

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 36:23

Uh let's see. Cryptid uh dog. Oh man. This is going to bug the crap out of me.

SPEAKER_00 36:32

Uh because I recently saw um actually it was today or yesterday, somewhere there's some uh gift shop or museum in one of these small little towns somewhere in America where they have uh the top part of a dog and the back part of a gator, the dog gator. It's like some of the old ghost ghost photos with ectoplasm. Exactly, you know. Yeah, the double exposure. Jackalope reminds me of the jackalope of the Southwest, you know.

SPEAKER_01 37:02

Yeah, for the life of me, I can't remember what it was. Um, but it this dude claims he has a taxidermide um cryptid that he shot um back in like the 90s and had a taxidermide, and it's sitting it's sitting in some museum, but I can't remember what what cryptid it actually was. But this this falls in line with that, because uh I do believe that there is another instance where someone uh claimed that they had a casting of a Bigfoot footprint, and that one was debunked, but then there's another one that was uh considered plausible because of like the the the weight of of the arc or something, and the and the dude was saying I for I forgot what it was, it might it might have been a YouTube video or or document that I saw uh years ago, but there there is one I think it is in a museum, there's just one casting of a footprint, and that's the most plausible because the weight of it it mimics what the weight distribution should have been on an animal that large and having the regular five tolls is massive, massive uh casting of this of this footprint.

Bigfoot Tracks & Grover Krantz’s “Cripple Foot”

SPEAKER_02 38:15

I'd like to see some of the tracker students who are the more advanced trackers analyze some of that because there's a lot of what's called pressure releases in in a track, and even what they call micro pressure releases in the digits. There's all kinds of information in a track that goes beyond that. I'd I was always curious as to what Tom Brown would say about these tracks, but I'm not really sure why he he never got involved with that. But yeah, some of those some of those castings it seems like limited information sometimes when they're talking about it, like things like that. Because I I've heard I've seen uh a guy interviewed one time, he was talking about he was a hoaxer and he he wore stilts with the feet and to get a a bigger stride, and he would he did it on a a dirt road out in the forest where he knew people would see it. You know. What would that look like in the track? You know, how how would that show up? How would the pressure releases show up in a track like that?

SPEAKER_00 39:21

Well, for me, the most credible footprint that I've seen is the one that um anthropologist Grover Krantz analyzed, and you may remember this one, Stephen. It's the one with the deformed foot. The the creature has some injury, the bigfoot has an injury on his foot, and one of its toes is deformed and its its arch is uh uh deformed as well.

SPEAKER_02 39:46

Oh, nice which one I'm talking about, Stephen? Yeah, I do remember that, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 39:50

Yeah, uh anthropologist Grover Kranz uh analyzed that. He actually reconstructed the foot, what it would look like, the skeletal foot. And to me, that's the most one of the most credible ones because this is something that had could happen naturally to any creature, right? It's not trying to be a perfect footprint. And the other footprint, the the right footprint was normal, and the left one had this deformity. And so if you're a hoaxer, you know, I just don't think you would think uh to do something like that.

SPEAKER_02 40:20

You're trying to print it. I don't think so either.

SPEAKER_00 40:21

I think that the as a hoaxer you're just trying to make the best yeah, you're trying to make the best print you can, you know, to make the most believable. Yeah, right. So to me, and that and for those who are listening, you can easily Google that and go see what I'm talking about. Uh Grover Krantz, uh they call it the cripple foot, I think. Um and to me, that's the most one of the most credible Bigfoot.

SPEAKER_01 40:44

That's that's an awesome name for it. Right. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 40:48

Uh as far as foot tracks go, that's to be one of the best that I've seen that kind of lends some credibility to it.

SPEAKER_01 40:55

Yeah, and the the one I was thinking of is the Shunk of Warrican. That's the one I was thinking of. It was shot in Montana, and uh apparently there's a taxidermied version in a in a museum. And uh from the last time I did the research, no one was allowed to um investigate the taxidermy creature. So it's just it's just there. And I think it's I think it's behind glass as well.

SPEAKER_02 41:21

I I cannot remember 100%, but um uh so they won't they won't allow samples taken or anything like that?

SPEAKER_01 41:30

Right, it won't allow samples taken. Um there's there's no um uh it won't allow anybody to come in and and like get close investigations and things like that.

Wood Knocks, Rock Throwing & Communication

SPEAKER_00 41:40

Yeah, it's a bad sign. Red flag right there. Yeah. So um uh we were talking about uh uh the Bigfoot communications. One thing we we haven't talked about yet is the wood knocking as another form of communication between the Bigfoot. This is another common um um common feature or common uh behavior from the big the Bigfoot.

SPEAKER_01 42:06

Do y'all knocking allow cursing on your show?

SPEAKER_02 42:11

Uh we haven't been, but we haven't, but we're not gonna like I mean if if one slips up every now and that's not that big of a deal. Yeah. We're just not gonna be sailors or anything, but or we'll even against sailors, you know. We love you, sailors. You're great.

SPEAKER_01 42:25

All right, allow me to be the first person to curse on your show. That would those knocking would scare the shit out of me. Oh just just just put just putting it out there.

SPEAKER_00 42:34

Yeah, if you're way out there, way out there, way out there, yeah, and it's dark, and all you hear is a cracking of fire, and then wood knocking, and also rocks. They knocking rocks or throwing of rocks. Can you imagine you're sitting there and then a a rock just comes flying into your camp?

SPEAKER_01 42:55

What I'm picturing it is you're you're alone in the dark, way in the wet wilderness. Your fire is going, and you hear rhythmic knocking on your left side, and then you hear a response on your right side, yeah, and then you hear a different one going forward to you, and then another one in the back of you, and they're all different, and they're all going like one goes, then the other goes, one goes and the other goes.

SPEAKER_02 43:22

Yeah, that that's just so that is so that would attest to their ability to track you, to find you in in in that environment and and come to you. So so how would they do that? Well, the the scouts could do that. So so that that's entirely the feasible and and believable behavior for me. Because we hear about it so much. I mean, there's a ton of of the the tree knocking. And allegedly a lot of a lot of these videos you see, you know, someone will actually knock and then you'll get a response that that you know, that could just be their buddy over there beating on a tree, you know. But but It is it makes sense to me that being as good at at in their environment as they are that they could find you, uh that's a testament to their ability to track.

SPEAKER_01 44:10

Yeah. Now this does go into well, is it actually Sasquatch? Because in the world in the realm of of paranormal and cryptids, like there's a there's a another possibility that it could be a doppelganger that is out there trying to lure you in or trying to or trying to find you. And the the thing that uh distinguishes from credible uh Sasquatch research and evidence is probably it probably has to to be the the rhythmic and the like the the spacing in between those knocks. It's not sporadic, it's not just someone trying to scare you, it's it's it it feels like it is some type of language.

SPEAKER_00 44:59

Yeah, it's it's like a form of communication. Right, yeah. Agreed. Yeah. Yeah, that's that's a good point. Helps separate it from or even uh some thoughts of like um spirits, you know, hauntings. Right. Uh time that's a common thing too. Uh the the shuttering of doors, the knocking on walls, you know, uh but if you're out in the middle of the middle of nowhere, it's probably less likely to be a spirit unless you happen to be in a ancient burial grounds of uh you know Native Americans or something.

SPEAKER_01 45:32

Yeah, because that's a whole nother episode too, because uh I grew up I grew up Catholic and and when that is that is drilled into the the teachings of uh spirits and and uh other you know unwanted creatures that are lurking looking around thing. Yeah, it it it spawns off this this whole another uh can of worms that it's yeah, it's it'd be a headache to get into right now. But uh but yeah, man, uh that would that would definitely scare scare the crap

Tree Structures & Possible Markers

SPEAKER_01 46:07

out of me.

SPEAKER_00 46:07

Yeah, and another form of communication along those same lines, uh, that's common behavior in Bigfoot is these uh structures and sting formations that they make out in the wilderness. Um you guys familiar with that, right? Yeah. I am not. Oh okay, so yeah, so it's very common uh for the people to come hunters or whatever, hikers, come across where you see deliberate trees that are formed into like uh like a pyramid or lean to structures, and these these are not lean to like a camper might make, these are like large trees, they're 12, 16 inches in diameter, snapped, uh, and form shapes. In fact, there's a uh pretty well-known case uh that happened in Morton, Washington. There was these two night watchmen in the remote logging area, and they saw these structures, and they're they're and this happened for over like two or three months. They were watching this, and they would hear vocalizations, they would find tracks, and then they would find these tripod and teepee like structures out and lean twos and woven branches and rows of poles just sticking in the ground, like green, not not rotten or dead wood, but green wood. Yeah, and that's another common thing. A lot of these trees are are are were live, you know, they were living trees, so you'll see they'll still see the greenery on the branches.

SPEAKER_02 47:38

Well or the roots the root side would be up upwards, yeah. And stuck in the ground.

SPEAKER_00 47:44

Exactly. Yeah. Um, so these same gentlemen, these same night witchmen night watchmen uh were so curious by this that they set up their own structure amongst the other structures. And when later when they came back, their structure was dismantled and stacked to the side. And the rather structures were still there. Oh wow. Now, this is a remote logging, you know, out in the middle of the the woods.

SPEAKER_02 48:10

So Yeah, they're probably being watched. Seriously, they're probably being watched, and and some of those structures I've heard are are forms of communication. Like they would have some some of the trees pointing in a certain direction. So it could be like friend markers when you're hiking. You finally pop piles of rock when you're crossing an area where the tr trail kind of breaks up and it's not so obvious. You'll see these friend markers, maybe something like that. Maybe for the younger the younger South Scotch, you know.

SPEAKER_00 48:40

Pointing towards water sources, yeah. You know, I mean, it's not I mean Native Americans did it, Boy Scouts do it, you know, trail hikers do it, you know, even these stacking of rocks.

SPEAKER_02 48:51

Any anything intelligent would do it.

Robert’s Bigfoot Encounter & Snapped Trees

SPEAKER_00 48:54

Yeah, exactly. Yeah, yeah. And you know, they're finding these in the middle of nowhere, like in British Columbia in the in these vast forests, you know. And uh uh one guy that I follow on YouTube, his his name is uh Robert. Uh he does the cabin in the woods, and he started his YouTube channel, just him and his little family were building this cabin in the woods. And that was the that was all he posted for the first two, three years of his channel. And then he was in vacation with his wife and daughter, and he had an encounter with Bigfoot. He actually a Bigfoot threw a rock at him and his daughter, and they kept the rock, and it was a deliberate throw. And they're out in the middle of nowhere, there's no one else around. And so later he went back in that woods at night and had an encounter and scared the crap out of him. So he came back the next day and he found broken tree limbs fresh, like the uh limb. He had heard he heard the breaking, the snapping of the limbs the night before. So that's why he went back to see. And these were brand new tree. I mean, these are healthy trees and still had green on the branches, green leaves and stuff, and they were snapped like like you and I would snap a one-inch twig. You know, they were just snapped. And then he saw the Bigfoot. He has video on his channel. The Bigfoot is staring at him. You it's it's just looks like a lump. It's a little hard to make out. But that thing is standing, it is sitting still for a long period of time. And that's the other thing. These uh Bigfoot are trained, they're masters at at uh sitting still, and that's why otherwise they're hard to find unless they're moving. Because if they're sitting still, the chances you finding them are.

SPEAKER_02 50:36

That's right. Well, that that's what deer do. The they'll lay down in the day and then they'll move around at night. But they every now and then uh there have been moments where uh there would be a deer, or someone would point it out, and I'm looking, I don't I don't see anything, and then you'd see an ear flutter. Oh, there it is. You know. So that's something that's just in nature. The the scouts did, the lip and Apache scouts did that. They would they would teach it. In fact, they would say this on the first run of this, where they would when you're they're sitting there and they would do this with their face. They wouldn't smile or anything like that to to make out a face, they would tighten their eyes and and uh just to kind of you know disappear a little bit more. But that's common. Yeah.

Stealth, Camouflage & “Disappearing” Sasquatch

SPEAKER_01 51:21

Yeah, and this falls into some some theories and uh some beliefs that something like Bigfoot and s uh and well, Sasquatch have uh supernatural and and magical properties that they can that they can disappear. But this this does offer a um a way to explain how they do that. So they they can be one with their environment, they can lower their heart rate, they can uh lower their their breathing rate, um, they can become hidden in plain in plain sight. So through my like through my my regular research and and doing the the show, every so often I come across videos and and uh small little uh little snippets of of literature or whatever that state, well, there's a possibility that this is a uh supernatural type of creature. Uh but to your point, Stephen, this does offer a way to explain that hypothesis and that theory that they can't just vanish. It is because their ability and their evolutionary traits of doing this. Now, what school of thought do y'all like gravitate towards on Sasquatch? Uh, I know we talked about this la uh last time, but uh I do want to uh mention it again. Uh I I go into the that Sasquatch is a biological primate of relationships to ancestral beings. That that is my stance. It is intelligent, and uh it's there's there's no there's no magical properties uh to uh to point to put that out there. It is uh heavily intelligent and is an ancestral being from ancient uh species. So how about y'all?

SPEAKER_02 53:12

Well, I think Sasquatch is both biological and I don't look at it as paranormal or supernatural, although that's probably a good way of putting it. I just think it's it's natural that we don't yet understand. Because even even some of the stories, and I go back to the to the tracker school, one story in particular of Tom Brown Junior, when he was younger he was being chased up in the pine barrens by wild dogs. They had a problem with wild dogs at the time. And uh we in the area I live now, we've had the same problem when I was a kid, so I could relate. But he's running from these dogs and he gets cornered where s there are some fallen trees. So he goes in he just immediately knows he's trapped, so he goes into this this technique of uh a type of meditative state that they they train on, and he claims that he he comes out of it and he looks all around like he like he just kind of p went unconscious. Comes back, he reads the tracks of the dogs all around him, they were searching for him, and then they exited. So it would seem that and this is coming from Tom Brown, it would seem that he somehow raised his consciousness or or something. Something happened to where he physically exited and came back. And there was another story where exercises that that he would teach, there was a a lady that called in and she demanded she says, It's very urgent, I I need to talk to Tom Brown. So he he says, I normally don't take calls like that. He says, But I took this one, and this lady explained that she had been practicing some of these meditative type exercises on the couch at her mother's house. So she lays down and then drifts off, she gets back up and she walks into the kitchen and her mother turns around stunned. Where have you been? She says, The police have been here, we've been looking for you, and she's like, I was on the couch. As if she had phased out. So to me, I I don't I don't know about that, right? But if that's I believe that we could potentially do things like that. So if that's the case and and you have uh intelligent creatures like Sasquatch that know how to go, change the f vibration frequencies of their brains into alpha and who knows where Delta, who knows where they go and still be able to function. Or maybe just phase out. And maybe that's why if I remember correctly, Tom Brown wasn't quite conscious of what happened in between. Well that means unconscious. So that's like going into like de delta and theta, I believe. Like really really low frequencies of of the brain. So what what's happening? Are you phasing out of reality into a different dimension? Don't know. But it's interesting because I there there are connections there, you know, with these stories I hear and uh the fact that Sasquatch can just kind of vanish. A lot of that has got to be technique, the physical technique. For example, sitting still. Also, they're covered in hair. You know, they they they they blend in. Because also it's like the the Lip and Apache scouts, they they lived in in the shadows of your perception. So your brain is drawing reality all the time and it doesn't always process things. If it is makes an assumption, it may pass right over you.

SPEAKER_01 56:36

Right.

SPEAKER_02 56:36

Uh I did an exercise one time where there were b bees covering this tree that I was sitting still in front of, and I didn't see bees at first. I just saw I saw the the plant, and then I realized, oh there's all these flowers. Oh, I didn't see the flowers. And then I literally after that remember seeing it looked like the bees like materialized from nothing on the flowers. The the the bush was covered in bees, but I didn't I didn't see them when I sat in front of it. I didn't see the flowers. So it was the staging of my my consciousness catching up and my brain drawing in reality. Because I don't think that the bees I think the bees were there all along. I just didn't see them. I didn't have the eyes to see it.

SPEAKER_01 57:21

That goes that goes into uh we could branch off that and goes into like uh martial arts and kung fu artists, and then we go into physics and into uh um uh parallel universes going living side by side. That's very, very interesting.

SPEAKER_02 57:38

It is, it is. Yeah, well that's why uh it's not necessarily explainable logically. A lot of it is is more, I think, like you're shooting from the hip. But go ahead, Michael, uh, what

Human Perception, Brain Filtering & the Unknown

SPEAKER_02 57:49

you're gonna say.

SPEAKER_00 57:49

Oh no, I was just gonna cap on to what you were saying, is that that's why eyewitness testimony is one of the worst in in the court of law, is because you know, our brains uh we filter things, we uh it you know, it fills in gaps when it puts information there that it sh probably isn't there.

SPEAKER_03 58:09

Right.

SPEAKER_00 58:09

Um, you know, our brain power, it's it well here's a perfect example. Uh you know, it's it takes a lot to be aware of your surroundings, your brain is doing millions of functions every every second, right? So if it can filter out some things that doesn't have to concentrate on or think about, that helps the brain function more effectively. Well, a good example is that people are smokers, habitual smokers. They cannot smell cigarette smoke. Well, smelling it takes up a lot of brain power, it takes a lot of brain function. So if the brain can filter out that smell that's always there, that helps save energy, helps save brain power because it doesn't have to think about that. So that's a perfect real-world example. And and in your example, Steven, that's why eye testimony is not always really good, because you know, our brain filters out things we don't need to know. You know, if we're not hyper focusing on something, it just gives us information it needs to survive. And that's why this brings full circle to telepathy in these kids that have a severe autism who are non-verbal or adults with Alzheimer's is because they don't longer have that connection to their physical body, so the rest of their senses become more heightened and they're not burdened by that, so they become hyper-aware of their surroundings, so that because their brain is not needing to perform these other functions with their body, you know, and and that's kind of lends to the fact that maybe that's why they can do telepathy and and have a other supernatural ability. We we we label it supernatural, but there might be natural abilities that we've lost connection with because we've had to use our other senses to survive, and that takes a lot of brain power to do that.

SPEAKER_02 59:59

Yeah, yeah, it's like nature. Nature is more it's not supernatural, paranormal, it's just nature we don't yet understand.

Final Thoughts on Bigfoot

SPEAKER_01 1:00:07

Yeah, yeah. And there and there's there is a lot of things we we have yet to understand about about nature and laws of nature, man. Uh incredible. We are approaching, well, actually, I think we're over an hour now, and time really does fly when you're when you're having fun. Yeah, yes, it does. Uh yeah, so uh any last words, Michael and Steven.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:35

Oh, I was just gonna say uh yeah, thank you for having us uh on your platform and uh give us this opportunity to talk to you about these things. Uh as we talked about the last time we tried to record, you and we've all been friends for more than a decade or more. Yeah, and and we've never talked about this stuff. Uh and so um it's fun to talk to you about this, even though I know you've had this podcast for five years or so.

SPEAKER_03 1:01:01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:01

Um, you know, it's just not something it is because it is strange, you know, and you don't talk about it with everybody because you don't want to you know come across as a weirdo or something, but that that doesn't change the facts that Bigfoot is real. It's just that people are on a different spectrum, they're on their different their own journey. You have to go on your own journey on something like this because it is from the outside view, it does seem fantastical and it does seem supernatural. And uh but it's really not when you use your critical thinking skills, your critical brain, and dissect the evidence and look at the evidence and study it, it's not fantastical. It's this is a real creature out there in our world. And I I love I would love to the point where you get to the point where we can have some real documented interactions with one and we can understand them better. And maybe we can actually, as a human race, become uh more adaptable to their lives, you know, and make things a little easier for them because as our population is growing, you know, we're encroaching more and more onto their onto their world. Uh maybe we could find some harmony there.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:14

Uh I would say just keep an open mind with all of these type of bizarre subjects. You don't have to believe everything. It's not about believing everything all at once. It's just about having an open mind and taking it in piece by piece and just considering it. And if if you have an interest in this kind of stuff, I have I have an interest because it's strange, it it leads to more of the unknown. Some of it's scary, some of it is just straight up interesting, and it gives me hope. And I think that's a good thing. So just just keep an open mind. You d you don't have to believe all this stuff. A lot of the stuff that that I research, I don't 100% believe either. But I I I take it in and eventually enough dots connect that it I give it either give it a thumbs up or I'll give it a thumbs down. You know, it just depends. In this case, you know, I I see no reason why Bigfoot as a species can't exist because they can.

SPEAKER_00 1:03:11

Yeah, agreed. Yeah, I mean, it's just uh like I said, people just have to go on their own journeys. And that's why that's how a lot of these Bigfoot researchers start, because as we talked about a little bit before, there's there's a lot of noise out there, a lot of fake stuff, and so they want to discover it on their own and find the real truth. And all these researchers, they when they go looking, they do find it, and then they become uh you know experts on on the topic because they too were once very skeptical uh about the whole thing, and or maybe they were neutral about it until they actually went out in the woods and had did their own research and stuff.

SPEAKER_02 1:03:50

So one thing leads to another sometimes with your research, and you realize that you didn't understand what you thought you did, and like, oh there this is kind of interesting, you know, and it leads you on to the next thing. Then you realize you're you're a conspiracy theorist like the rest of us, you know.

SPEAKER_01 1:04:10

One of us.

Inquirium & 50 States of Terror Wrap-Up

SPEAKER_00 1:04:12

One of us. One of us. You need a t shirt. Yeah. And just one last thing. Uh, for those of you listening at to uh Anthony's podcast, uh, you can find us at inquiryampodcast.com. Yes, uh, we'll be our episodes will air every second and fourth Tuesday of every month. First one is September 8th, and Inquerium is spelled I N Q U I R I U M. And that's just a made-up word, like uh a Latin word for inquisitive or inquiry. So that's where that came from.

SPEAKER_01 1:04:48

That's awesome. That is awesome. Thank you guys so much for taking the time out to talk, Bigfoot. Um, yeah, so uh I'm excited for your first episode to come out. I cannot wait. Uh, I'm going to plug the hell out of it on my next couple of shows.

SPEAKER_03 1:05:05

Thank you. Thank you.

SPEAKER_01 1:05:07

Yeah, absolutely, dude. When it comes out, I'm going to be putting the show notes and everything. Um, and we we all grow together as a team, man.

SPEAKER_03 1:05:14

Hell yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:05:15

And uh, yep, my name is Anthony Diaz. I am the host of 50 Seats of Terror, the American Character Podcast, and that is a show brought to you by Alpha Line Productions LLC. Thank you all for listening. I appreciate every single one of you who tune in to the show, and tune in to their show when it comes out September 8th, you said, and we will 100% be plugging that all the way through. Thank you, guys.

SPEAKER_00 1:05:44

Thanks, thank you, sir. Thank you, everyone. Later, y'all.